Dune House Atreides

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Dune House Atreides / Comments on Dune: House Atreides / Ixians, Complexity...

Edric
User ID: 8158483 Jul 12th 7:29 PM
First, I have to say that I´ve really liked House Atreides. I am nothing but thankful to B.H. & K.J.A. for continuing with my all time favourite SI-FI saga.
Once said this, my comments:

IXIANS: In the first 6 books we never Knew about IX more than a few glimpses: Hi-tech civilization, always on the edge of Butlerian Jihad precepts,and little more. We never got to know any of them as an -important or not- character, as far as I remember, there wasn´t a single description about their planet, or how they-Ixians-would look like... And in my opinion, that was the point about Ixians, we never knew anything about them besides their technical advances; they were ambiguous, mysterious... and if I had to describe them, It would be just the opposite to the characters in House Atreides... Trying to put them as another Great House, I just think It doesn´t work. They should be less-human, more machine-like people. As the Tleilaxu: I´ve always seen them as people who have lost great part of their humanity. My explanation has taken me too long-sorry-, but I think you all are getting my point.

COMPLEXITY: There is a difference between the old Dune and this prequel/s? in terms of complexity:
The first 6 novels had that unique Frank Herbert style. I mean they were COMPLEX, hard to follow plot -I´ve always have the impression that Herbert tried to play with the reader as well as with the characters- you never knew where you were taken: surprises, plots inside plots inside plots, secret plans (¿¿¿golden path??), all the mistery and danger surrounding the characters and above all, the inteligence shown by all of them (forget the stupid bad or the allmighty good).
Reading House Atreides, I didn´t have these feelings. Of course is well written, but it lacks of the complexity or the overall style of the old ones.
B.H. & K.J.A. have done a great job with this book. I know they can´t fulfil all our expectations as Dune is deeply inside our hearts and minds and everyone has their own opinion, so here is mine.

Margo
User ID: 1397584 Sep 22nd 11:12 AM
What was that about the Ixians? I didn't seem to recall any outward description of them in Dune, or of their planet. I certainly did not expect all their technological creation to be kept below the surface as was hinted in HA, is it only after Leto II that they "emerged"? Or also, I never expected them to be ruled by a single great House, rather surprising isn't it? Like you, I've always thought the Ixians to be independent ppl, masters of their own time, space and fate. Guess you can't rely on Little Herbert...

Seele
User ID: 0464054 Apr 28th 1:45 PM
I see no real problem with the Ixians portrayed in HA. Leto's perception of the Ixians, and the ruling house are basically of high regard, as he is a fellow noble in this world...and as we all saw..the house is rather sinister in their dealings..they are almost like the ordos....there to make a buck at any cost.

Ending Dream 23
User ID: 9391453 Apr 28th 5:25 PM
The point is its 'Ixians', not 'House Ixian'.

Vandevere
User ID: 2066234 Apr 28th 6:08 PM
Frank Herbert DID mention two Ixians in "God Emperor". One was Malky. The other was Hwi Noree. Make of this what you will.

Vandevere

someone Oct 1st 11:34 AM
WHAT! I've read the prequels b4 the actual series (still regret it) but isnt there some point in the original Dune novels that they were NOT ruled by Great House?(Ixian Confederacy or something)

Freakzilla
User ID: 0255034 Oct 1st 4:27 PM
In Dune Messiah the Ixians are refered to as a confederacy.

A Simple Fremen Oct 2nd 11:09 AM
i also find it not plausible that IX is a major/minor royal house of the Landsraad.

i think there sort of like the guild where they have a purpose and live quite content to create and sell the products they make never grabbing the sword themselves to rule as Paul says to describe the Guild.

Although...does anybody remember the Sauderkar being refered to as House Sardekaur by Frank Herbert himself in Dune.

So maybe it is possible that Ix was ruled by a royal famili. Also i think later on in the series it it mentioned that some technologie came from a competitor on the planet called Richese which i believe was ruled by a royal house. But on this point i,m not sure.

BTW i,m on my 3rd reading of the series(just finished Dune for the third time)and i must say this book just gets more and more fascinating and deep.

Long Live The Fighters of Muaddib!

Freakzilla
User ID: 7991113 Oct 2nd 10:04 PM
"Although...does anybody remember the Sauderkar being refered to as House Sardekaur by Frank Herbert himself in Dune."

Three times:

The Baron Vladimir Harkonnen stood with eyes downcast in the Imperial
audience chamber, the oval selamlik within the Padishah Emperor's hutment. With
covert glances, the Baron had studied the metal-walled room and its occupants --
the noukkers, the pages, the guards, the troop of House Sardaukar drawn up
around the walls, standing at ease there beneath the bloody and tattered
captured battle flags that were the room's only decoration.

Another crash shook the hutment. The double doors banged open at the far
side of the chamber admitting wind-blown sand and the sound of shouting. A
small, black-robed figure could be seen momentarily against the light -- Alia
darting out to find a knife and, as befitted her Fremen training, to kill
Harkonnen and Sardaukar wounded. House Sardaukar charged through a greened
yellow haze toward the opening, weapons ready, forming an arc there to protect
the Emperor's retreat.

Onward toward the Emperor's hutment they came while the House Sardaukar
stood awed for the first time in their history by an onslaught their minds found
difficult to accept.

The term "House Sardaukar" means the Sardaukar who were the Royal Guard, they were in their master's house as opposed to being in the field.

Ix was a technocracy.

shinnok
User ID: 0492334 Oct 2nd 10:36 PM
It means House Corrino's Imperial Guard, the household's security force. Somewhere before that quote, there's a mention of how the over confident emperor bought his entire household, including his daughters, concubines and even some guests. What he should've brought was more Sardaukar.

A Simple Fremen Oct 3rd 10:33 AM
that's actually my favorite 2 pages of the whole book(p464-465. i also just found myself in awe of the events beautifully described by FH.

A Simple Fremen Oct 3rd 10:34 AM
p.s. what 's a technocracy?

A Simple Fremen Oct 3rd 1:29 PM
p.s. Long Live The Fighters of Muaddib!

Freakzilla
User ID: 7991113 Oct 3rd 7:41 PM
tech·noc·ra·cy

n. pl. tech·noc·ra·cies

A government or social system controlled by technicians, especially scientists and technical experts.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

Seruna Kanus
User ID: 0554384 Feb 7th 6:08 PM
I've a fanfiction regarding House Vernius, and I realized the irony of how Rhombur establishes the Confederacy, leaves, and is almost drawn into another confederacy on the planet he fled to. If anyone wishes to see the fanfiction I will post it.

-Seru King

jthvzz
User ID: 9099093 Jul 7th 11:32 AM
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Edric User ID: 8158483	Jul 12th 7:29 PM First, I have to say that I´ve really liked House Atreides. I am nothing but thankful to B.H. & K.J.A. for continuing with my all time favourite SI-FI saga. Once said this, my comments: IXIANS: In the first 6 books we never Knew about IX more than a few glimpses: Hi-tech civilization, always on the edge of Butlerian Jihad precepts,and little more. We never got to know any of them as an -important or not- character, as far as I remember, there wasn´t a single description about their planet, or how they-Ixians-would look like... And in my opinion, that was the point about Ixians, we never knew anything about them besides their technical advances; they were ambiguous, mysterious... and if I had to describe them, It would be just the opposite to the characters in House Atreides... Trying to put them as another Great House, I just think It doesn´t work. They should be less-human, more machine-like people. As the Tleilaxu: I´ve always seen them as people who have lost great part of their humanity. My explanation has taken me too long-sorry-, but I think you all are getting my point. COMPLEXITY: There is a difference between the old Dune and this prequel/s? in terms of complexity: The first 6 novels had that unique Frank Herbert style. I mean they were COMPLEX, hard to follow plot -I´ve always have the impression that Herbert tried to play with the reader as well as with the characters- you never knew where you were taken: surprises, plots inside plots inside plots, secret plans (¿¿¿golden path??), all the mistery and danger surrounding the characters and above all, the inteligence shown by all of them (forget the stupid bad or the allmighty good). Reading House Atreides, I didn´t have these feelings. Of course is well written, but it lacks of the complexity or the overall style of the old ones. B.H. & K.J.A. have done a great job with this book. I know they can´t fulfil all our expectations as Dune is deeply inside our hearts and minds and everyone has their own opinion, so here is mine.
Margo User ID: 1397584	Sep 22nd 11:12 AM What was that about the Ixians? I didn't seem to recall any outward description of them in Dune, or of their planet. I certainly did not expect all their technological creation to be kept below the surface as was hinted in HA, is it only after Leto II that they "emerged"? Or also, I never expected them to be ruled by a single great House, rather surprising isn't it? Like you, I've always thought the Ixians to be independent ppl, masters of their own time, space and fate. Guess you can't rely on Little Herbert...
Seele User ID: 0464054	Apr 28th 1:45 PM I see no real problem with the Ixians portrayed in HA. Leto's perception of the Ixians, and the ruling house are basically of high regard, as he is a fellow noble in this world...and as we all saw..the house is rather sinister in their dealings..they are almost like the ordos....there to make a buck at any cost.
Ending Dream 23 User ID: 9391453	Apr 28th 5:25 PM The point is its 'Ixians', not 'House Ixian'.
Vandevere User ID: 2066234	Apr 28th 6:08 PM Frank Herbert DID mention two Ixians in "God Emperor". One was Malky. The other was Hwi Noree. Make of this what you will. Vandevere
someone	Oct 1st 11:34 AM WHAT! I've read the prequels b4 the actual series (still regret it) but isnt there some point in the original Dune novels that they were NOT ruled by Great House?(Ixian Confederacy or something)
Freakzilla User ID: 0255034	Oct 1st 4:27 PM In Dune Messiah the Ixians are refered to as a confederacy.
A Simple Fremen	Oct 2nd 11:09 AM i also find it not plausible that IX is a major/minor royal house of the Landsraad. i think there sort of like the guild where they have a purpose and live quite content to create and sell the products they make never grabbing the sword themselves to rule as Paul says to describe the Guild. Although...does anybody remember the Sauderkar being refered to as House Sardekaur by Frank Herbert himself in Dune. So maybe it is possible that Ix was ruled by a royal famili. Also i think later on in the series it it mentioned that some technologie came from a competitor on the planet called Richese which i believe was ruled by a royal house. But on this point i,m not sure. BTW i,m on my 3rd reading of the series(just finished Dune for the third time)and i must say this book just gets more and more fascinating and deep. Long Live The Fighters of Muaddib!
Freakzilla User ID: 7991113	Oct 2nd 10:04 PM "Although...does anybody remember the Sauderkar being refered to as House Sardekaur by Frank Herbert himself in Dune." Three times: The Baron Vladimir Harkonnen stood with eyes downcast in the Imperial audience chamber, the oval selamlik within the Padishah Emperor's hutment. With covert glances, the Baron had studied the metal-walled room and its occupants -- the noukkers, the pages, the guards, the troop of House Sardaukar drawn up around the walls, standing at ease there beneath the bloody and tattered captured battle flags that were the room's only decoration. Another crash shook the hutment. The double doors banged open at the far side of the chamber admitting wind-blown sand and the sound of shouting. A small, black-robed figure could be seen momentarily against the light -- Alia darting out to find a knife and, as befitted her Fremen training, to kill Harkonnen and Sardaukar wounded. House Sardaukar charged through a greened yellow haze toward the opening, weapons ready, forming an arc there to protect the Emperor's retreat. Onward toward the Emperor's hutment they came while the House Sardaukar stood awed for the first time in their history by an onslaught their minds found difficult to accept. The term "House Sardaukar" means the Sardaukar who were the Royal Guard, they were in their master's house as opposed to being in the field. Ix was a technocracy.
shinnok User ID: 0492334	Oct 2nd 10:36 PM It means House Corrino's Imperial Guard, the household's security force. Somewhere before that quote, there's a mention of how the over confident emperor bought his entire household, including his daughters, concubines and even some guests. What he should've brought was more Sardaukar.
A Simple Fremen	Oct 3rd 10:33 AM that's actually my favorite 2 pages of the whole book(p464-465. i also just found myself in awe of the events beautifully described by FH.
A Simple Fremen	Oct 3rd 10:34 AM p.s. what 's a technocracy?
A Simple Fremen	Oct 3rd 1:29 PM p.s. Long Live The Fighters of Muaddib!
Freakzilla User ID: 7991113	Oct 3rd 7:41 PM tech·noc·ra·cy n. pl. tech·noc·ra·cies A government or social system controlled by technicians, especially scientists and technical experts. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
Seruna Kanus User ID: 0554384	Feb 7th 6:08 PM I've a fanfiction regarding House Vernius, and I realized the irony of how Rhombur establishes the Confederacy, leaves, and is almost drawn into another confederacy on the planet he fled to. If anyone wishes to see the fanfiction I will post it. -Seru King
jthvzz User ID: 9099093	Jul 7th 11:32 AM RPc20J <a href="http://wfoneatqdzfs.com/">wfoneatqdzfs</a>, [url=http://jargjqznitsk.com/]jargjqznitsk[/url], [link=http://gvuzasfxatyr.com/]gvuzasfxatyr[/link], http://yfzdmilyqxry.com/