Dune House Atreides

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Dune House Atreides / Comments on Dune: House Atreides / Traditions

Liza
User ID: 8792653 Dec 28th 4:09 PM
Leadership passes from father to son in the Dune Series, and now the task of writing this epic series has been passed from father to son. This transition asks important questions about what Frank Herbert had intended to do with his series before his untimely death. I do not know of any evidence that FH wanted his son to continue on with the project. The rich imagination and genius that went into the Dune Chronicles was the work of one man. Perhaps the legacy will lose some of its importance if these prequels do not keep up with the incredibly high standards Frank Herbert set for himself. I have read the novel and I feel that it was nothing more than an attempt to relate details of what happened before Dune in a very textbook like fashion. Too much explanation and not enough mystery. I have a feeling that by the time this trilogy is finished Dune will be reduced to a drab and predictable world, with its fire extinguished. I find it so ironic that this legacy is experiencing the same stagnation the Dune Series adamantly warned against. As for Kevin J. Anderson, he goes where the profits go.

Liza
User ID: 1592424 Jan 5th 1:00 PM
I would really like to hear what others thought of the novel, and of course my estimation of the novel. It's no fun making comments when no one replys to them! I would really like to start a serious discussion with someone about this novel. It is important for some research I wish to begin on Frank Herbert. I would like to do my Master's Thesis on Herbert, but I want some feedback first of all. Can Dune and the rest of the series be considered serious literature?

Lapdog
User ID: 7127533 Jan 5th 1:53 PM
Liza,

I felt your estimation of House Atreides was not far off the mark. Readers looking for the depth and imagination of Frank's work within HA would be sorely disappointed. It doesn't even come close.
When I heard of it's release I set my expectations fairly low. I didn't expect greatness or a reincarnation of Frank, hopefully just a decent read. And it turned out to be just that. Fair. A little like a small piece of mind-candy. Not a full meal.
Personally I felt that some of the story threads were vastly better than others. And I expect the remainder of the novels to follow the same path. Surely not the "Golden Path". :)
Whether Frank intended for his son to pick up where his work left off is uncertain. Maybe if he still lived his son might have contributed. Who knows. What is only known is that a few years ago Brian Herbert stumbled upon a huge cache of Frank's notes detailing much of the ground Brian and Kevin are covering. With that we can at least rest assured that, in a textbook manner, the source material will have at least come from Frank's brain.

Lapdog
(Argueing the pros and cons of HA is difficult on a message board. I may have rambled a bit)

P.S. If you have no luck in this forum for HA debate here's another you can try. You'll see me around there too. http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/preludetodune/

Dave
User ID: 9398453 Jan 11th 9:44 AM
Although Frank Herbert's writing technique and ability will not be matched, this does not mean that any new books written will diminish Dune by anymeans.
What must be noted though, is that Dune (6 books) is DUNE, and a must read first. Because of the differences new readers who read the new Dune books may not think as highly of them, and NOT read Dune or the following books. On the otherhand, Starwars type readers may read the new Dune books, like them, but not like the real Dune books. But also, the new books do give a greater history of the Dune universe which I personally enjoy. Dispite this, I enjoyed HA as I had prepared myself for this type of book, and I look forward to future Dune books, EXCEPT BOOK 7, which I hope is not written as I cannot imagine Brian or Kevin being able to really conclude Mr. Herbert's ending with anything close to Mr. Herbert's ending. Hopefully a semi-finished manuscript written by Frank Herbert (a kind of 'notes' book)could be published to help finally conclude the cliff-hanager ending of Chapterhouse Dune. (book 6). But I wouldn't want HA style of writing for book 7. (just my opinion). But as for the prequel, and possible books around the Jihad, fire away!

liza
User ID: 1592424 Jan 13th 5:21 PM
lapdog

Thank you so much for replying to my post! Thank you also for the link, I will definitely visit it soon!

Mo
User ID: 0631424 Jan 17th 6:36 PM
I can't believe other ppl think the new novel is crap! I think it's GREAT! especially after reading part six, reading bout the old days does a lot of joy to me ;o)

Mehum_23
User ID: 0331974 Mar 21st 5:21 PM
Right on, Mo!

Ulsdan
User ID: 0930774 Apr 18th 9:22 AM
I got into the Dune universe pretty late in time, that being when I was about 11 or twelve, but I too came to appreciate the depth in which Frank Herbert crafted an entire universe for us to enjoy.

Now as to House Atreidies, despite my seemingly lack of credibilaty, was in my opinion a decent attempt at adding more depth to our understanding of the Dune Universe.

I doubt that anything can shatter the power of the original Dune Chronicles. The amount of energy, vitality and life imbued by Mr. Herbert ensures that they will remain as powerful pieces in the world of literature for many years to come, gracing the imaginations of several more generations.

For further comments, or merely simple sharings for your thesis, I'd be glad to help out. You can mail me at ulsdan_crai@hotmail.com. I suppose that also goes out to everyone else who ever reads this posting.

Keith
User ID: 2246984 Apr 22nd 9:47 PM
I thought that House Atreides didn't add up to the originals,but it was nice to get a little more on the Dune universe.

I would like to see an attempt at book 7, even if it is crap. I would like at least so sort of an end.

If anyone wants to contact me about this my email is Usal100@hotmail.com

Bryan from Mich
User ID: 0366544 Apr 24th 7:27 PM
I just finished reading House Atreides, and I have mixed feelings. I haven't read a Dune book in many years, and was very excited to learn that a book was coming out that focused on the early characters. I dug up my Dune Encylopedia and used it as a reference in case I forgot information about some of the characters.
The further I read, the greater my disappointment became. There are so many inconsistencies with the Encylopedia, I wonder if Brian Herbert had even bothered to read it. Many facts were blatantly wrong:

Leto was the sone of Mintor Atreides, NOT Paulos.
Leto's mother died during his delivery.
Leto avenged the death of his father in the bull-ring - it wasn't sliced to pieces by Hawat and his gaurds with lasguns
Leto became a Duke at 23, not 15
Elrood IX was emporor for 34 years, not over 100.
Duncan Idaho was a native of Caladan, not Geidi Prime.
Enormous events like the Trial by Forfeiture and the sacking of IX by the Tleilaxu were never mentioned in the Encylopedia.

I could go on and on. I find it unsettling that Brian Herbert didn't bother to align the prequel with the Dune Encyclopedia. The trilogy is so rich and there are so many unexplained events left open by Frank Herbert, I find it difficult to believe that Brian couldn't work within the constraints left by his father.

The book was well written and interestingbut it wasn't worth enduring the blatant disregard of Frank Herbert's original intent.

Am I the only one that was disturbed by this?

Robin H.
User ID: 2421434 Sep 1st 12:26 PM
To Bryan:
I agree with you, that the encyclopedia and the prequel can´t be seen as matching. But something seems funny to me. Neither the one nor the other was written by Herbert himself (as far as I understand). So why is one more credible than the other one ? To me, the encyclopedia never fit in really into the Universe. (e.g.the Duncan Idahoes, who were never reported in the novels to be cyborgs, harlekins or Gays <no insult here>)
It was closer to the novels, and some things were solved better than in HA (Holtzman), but it wasn´t perfect. (maybe, this would be to high a demand)
Now to HA: I think, one remarkable thing about the DUNE-Universe were the blank spots. No matter, how often I re-read the books, I was never entirely sure, if I had the right scope on the action. I could never imagine the last two battles in book 6, nor the enigmatic weapon of the honoured matres and why they were so much better than for example orbital bombardement. And I don´t know what happend in the diaspora. And these things make me think and wonder about the books. And therefor I estimate them the best piece of literrature, I ever read.
But all this dissappeared in HA. Everything is explained in detail, so that I don´t have to bother thinking. To me reading HA was enjoyable, but after havin read it, I was vastly disappointed by the way Brian had implemented his view on the DUNE-universe into the "official" line, because I prefer many of my Ideas to his.
But his book made me feel as if he had raped (well, drastic but it fits somewhat) the so sophisticated and multi-layered Universe created by his father. I surely don´t mean this as an accusation, I just think, Brian didn´t come up to the genius of his father (I don´t konw, if anybody else could. If one thinks, he knows an apt author, I would be very interested to hear of him/her: 003998@web.de)

Ending Dreams
User ID: 0345364 Sep 1st 6:51 PM
Raped?

I like that, it's a good word for House Atreides.

Margo
User ID: 1397584 Sep 2nd 8:37 AM
Long live Frank Herbert, wherever and whatever he may be... :-))

Robin H.
User ID: 7608433 Sep 16th 6:45 AM
Truer words were never spoken !

Margo
User ID: 1397584 Sep 18th 5:46 AM
Thanks Robin H! To Liza: The Dune books can certainly be thought of as serious lit, and I think they'd make great materiel for your Masters. What is your topic more exactly? And just for reference, read the original books first, go back to the prequels, then look at the Ency. I think that's the best way to develop a clearheaded view of everything.

Fedaykin
User ID: 0171704 Sep 19th 10:58 PM
some of you might remember me as the person who started coming on here when this message board was first formed proclaiming DUNE:HA to be an "abomination".
i'd like to add that i have one (poor condition - i took out my rage for the shoddy dissapointment on the book) hardcover edition of Dune: House Atreides for sale. further, i would encourage peopel NOT to purchase House Harkonnen, as it is surely just as butchered and whored out as the original.
Besides the fact i think it disgusting the DUNE series be exploited for profit, i consider it important for somebody to stand up to this in an organized fashion.

who want's to help me start a website/users group dedicated to Frank Herbert's DUNE universe?]

e-mail:
blackkronstadt@hotmail.com

long live the fighters.

Margo
User ID: 1397584 Sep 20th 8:34 AM
If you mean a group that claims Frank is good, Brian is bad then NO, thank you. I happen to be in favor of innovation.

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Liza User ID: 8792653	Dec 28th 4:09 PM Leadership passes from father to son in the Dune Series, and now the task of writing this epic series has been passed from father to son. This transition asks important questions about what Frank Herbert had intended to do with his series before his untimely death. I do not know of any evidence that FH wanted his son to continue on with the project. The rich imagination and genius that went into the Dune Chronicles was the work of one man. Perhaps the legacy will lose some of its importance if these prequels do not keep up with the incredibly high standards Frank Herbert set for himself. I have read the novel and I feel that it was nothing more than an attempt to relate details of what happened before Dune in a very textbook like fashion. Too much explanation and not enough mystery. I have a feeling that by the time this trilogy is finished Dune will be reduced to a drab and predictable world, with its fire extinguished. I find it so ironic that this legacy is experiencing the same stagnation the Dune Series adamantly warned against. As for Kevin J. Anderson, he goes where the profits go.
Liza User ID: 1592424	Jan 5th 1:00 PM I would really like to hear what others thought of the novel, and of course my estimation of the novel. It's no fun making comments when no one replys to them! I would really like to start a serious discussion with someone about this novel. It is important for some research I wish to begin on Frank Herbert. I would like to do my Master's Thesis on Herbert, but I want some feedback first of all. Can Dune and the rest of the series be considered serious literature?
Lapdog User ID: 7127533	Jan 5th 1:53 PM Liza, I felt your estimation of House Atreides was not far off the mark. Readers looking for the depth and imagination of Frank's work within HA would be sorely disappointed. It doesn't even come close. When I heard of it's release I set my expectations fairly low. I didn't expect greatness or a reincarnation of Frank, hopefully just a decent read. And it turned out to be just that. Fair. A little like a small piece of mind-candy. Not a full meal. Personally I felt that some of the story threads were vastly better than others. And I expect the remainder of the novels to follow the same path. Surely not the "Golden Path". :) Whether Frank intended for his son to pick up where his work left off is uncertain. Maybe if he still lived his son might have contributed. Who knows. What is only known is that a few years ago Brian Herbert stumbled upon a huge cache of Frank's notes detailing much of the ground Brian and Kevin are covering. With that we can at least rest assured that, in a textbook manner, the source material will have at least come from Frank's brain. Lapdog (Argueing the pros and cons of HA is difficult on a message board. I may have rambled a bit) P.S. If you have no luck in this forum for HA debate here's another you can try. You'll see me around there too. http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/preludetodune/
Dave User ID: 9398453	Jan 11th 9:44 AM Although Frank Herbert's writing technique and ability will not be matched, this does not mean that any new books written will diminish Dune by anymeans. What must be noted though, is that Dune (6 books) is DUNE, and a must read first. Because of the differences new readers who read the new Dune books may not think as highly of them, and NOT read Dune or the following books. On the otherhand, Starwars type readers may read the new Dune books, like them, but not like the real Dune books. But also, the new books do give a greater history of the Dune universe which I personally enjoy. Dispite this, I enjoyed HA as I had prepared myself for this type of book, and I look forward to future Dune books, EXCEPT BOOK 7, which I hope is not written as I cannot imagine Brian or Kevin being able to really conclude Mr. Herbert's ending with anything close to Mr. Herbert's ending. Hopefully a semi-finished manuscript written by Frank Herbert (a kind of 'notes' book)could be published to help finally conclude the cliff-hanager ending of Chapterhouse Dune. (book 6). But I wouldn't want HA style of writing for book 7. (just my opinion). But as for the prequel, and possible books around the Jihad, fire away!
liza User ID: 1592424	Jan 13th 5:21 PM lapdog Thank you so much for replying to my post! Thank you also for the link, I will definitely visit it soon!
Mo User ID: 0631424	Jan 17th 6:36 PM I can't believe other ppl think the new novel is crap! I think it's GREAT! especially after reading part six, reading bout the old days does a lot of joy to me ;o)
Mehum_23 User ID: 0331974	Mar 21st 5:21 PM Right on, Mo!
Ulsdan User ID: 0930774	Apr 18th 9:22 AM I got into the Dune universe pretty late in time, that being when I was about 11 or twelve, but I too came to appreciate the depth in which Frank Herbert crafted an entire universe for us to enjoy. Now as to House Atreidies, despite my seemingly lack of credibilaty, was in my opinion a decent attempt at adding more depth to our understanding of the Dune Universe. I doubt that anything can shatter the power of the original Dune Chronicles. The amount of energy, vitality and life imbued by Mr. Herbert ensures that they will remain as powerful pieces in the world of literature for many years to come, gracing the imaginations of several more generations. For further comments, or merely simple sharings for your thesis, I'd be glad to help out. You can mail me at ulsdan_crai@hotmail.com. I suppose that also goes out to everyone else who ever reads this posting.
Keith User ID: 2246984	Apr 22nd 9:47 PM I thought that House Atreides didn't add up to the originals,but it was nice to get a little more on the Dune universe. I would like to see an attempt at book 7, even if it is crap. I would like at least so sort of an end. If anyone wants to contact me about this my email is Usal100@hotmail.com
Bryan from Mich User ID: 0366544	Apr 24th 7:27 PM I just finished reading House Atreides, and I have mixed feelings. I haven't read a Dune book in many years, and was very excited to learn that a book was coming out that focused on the early characters. I dug up my Dune Encylopedia and used it as a reference in case I forgot information about some of the characters. The further I read, the greater my disappointment became. There are so many inconsistencies with the Encylopedia, I wonder if Brian Herbert had even bothered to read it. Many facts were blatantly wrong: Leto was the sone of Mintor Atreides, NOT Paulos. Leto's mother died during his delivery. Leto avenged the death of his father in the bull-ring - it wasn't sliced to pieces by Hawat and his gaurds with lasguns Leto became a Duke at 23, not 15 Elrood IX was emporor for 34 years, not over 100. Duncan Idaho was a native of Caladan, not Geidi Prime. Enormous events like the Trial by Forfeiture and the sacking of IX by the Tleilaxu were never mentioned in the Encylopedia. I could go on and on. I find it unsettling that Brian Herbert didn't bother to align the prequel with the Dune Encyclopedia. The trilogy is so rich and there are so many unexplained events left open by Frank Herbert, I find it difficult to believe that Brian couldn't work within the constraints left by his father. The book was well written and interestingbut it wasn't worth enduring the blatant disregard of Frank Herbert's original intent. Am I the only one that was disturbed by this?
Robin H. User ID: 2421434	Sep 1st 12:26 PM To Bryan: I agree with you, that the encyclopedia and the prequel can´t be seen as matching. But something seems funny to me. Neither the one nor the other was written by Herbert himself (as far as I understand). So why is one more credible than the other one ? To me, the encyclopedia never fit in really into the Universe. (e.g.the Duncan Idahoes, who were never reported in the novels to be cyborgs, harlekins or Gays <no insult here>) It was closer to the novels, and some things were solved better than in HA (Holtzman), but it wasn´t perfect. (maybe, this would be to high a demand) Now to HA: I think, one remarkable thing about the DUNE-Universe were the blank spots. No matter, how often I re-read the books, I was never entirely sure, if I had the right scope on the action. I could never imagine the last two battles in book 6, nor the enigmatic weapon of the honoured matres and why they were so much better than for example orbital bombardement. And I don´t know what happend in the diaspora. And these things make me think and wonder about the books. And therefor I estimate them the best piece of literrature, I ever read. But all this dissappeared in HA. Everything is explained in detail, so that I don´t have to bother thinking. To me reading HA was enjoyable, but after havin read it, I was vastly disappointed by the way Brian had implemented his view on the DUNE-universe into the "official" line, because I prefer many of my Ideas to his. But his book made me feel as if he had raped (well, drastic but it fits somewhat) the so sophisticated and multi-layered Universe created by his father. I surely don´t mean this as an accusation, I just think, Brian didn´t come up to the genius of his father (I don´t konw, if anybody else could. If one thinks, he knows an apt author, I would be very interested to hear of him/her: 003998@web.de)
Ending Dreams User ID: 0345364	Sep 1st 6:51 PM Raped? I like that, it's a good word for House Atreides.
Margo User ID: 1397584	Sep 2nd 8:37 AM Long live Frank Herbert, wherever and whatever he may be... :-))
Robin H. User ID: 7608433	Sep 16th 6:45 AM Truer words were never spoken !
Margo User ID: 1397584	Sep 18th 5:46 AM Thanks Robin H! To Liza: The Dune books can certainly be thought of as serious lit, and I think they'd make great materiel for your Masters. What is your topic more exactly? And just for reference, read the original books first, go back to the prequels, then look at the Ency. I think that's the best way to develop a clearheaded view of everything.
Fedaykin User ID: 0171704	Sep 19th 10:58 PM some of you might remember me as the person who started coming on here when this message board was first formed proclaiming DUNE:HA to be an "abomination". i'd like to add that i have one (poor condition - i took out my rage for the shoddy dissapointment on the book) hardcover edition of Dune: House Atreides for sale. further, i would encourage peopel NOT to purchase House Harkonnen, as it is surely just as butchered and whored out as the original. Besides the fact i think it disgusting the DUNE series be exploited for profit, i consider it important for somebody to stand up to this in an organized fashion. who want's to help me start a website/users group dedicated to Frank Herbert's DUNE universe?] e-mail: blackkronstadt@hotmail.com long live the fighters.
Margo User ID: 1397584	Sep 20th 8:34 AM If you mean a group that claims Frank is good, Brian is bad then NO, thank you. I happen to be in favor of innovation.