Dune House Atreides

Swirve.com Links: Swirve.com Free Email Games Fantasy Sports E-Cards Movies Horoscopes Freebies Web Search

NOTICE: Beginning July 10th, 2008, this message board service will no longer be active or available for use.

What is Authentication?

This forum system allows users to post under multiple names, inputting their name for each message. However, some users may wish to identify themselves in such a way that another user cannot impersonate him or her by posting under the same name. Authenticating a user displays a special code identifying the user by his or her computer. Thus any message without this unique User ID is likely not from the original user.

What is Authentication?
This forum system allows users to post under multiple names, inputting their name for each message. However, some users may wish to identify themselves in such a way that another user cannot impersonate him or her by posting under the same name. Authenticating a user displays a special code identifying the user by his or her computer. Thus any message without this unique User ID is likely not from the original user.

Dune House Atreides / Dune Mini-Series / Why "Purists" Didn't Appreciate1st Mini

Next 20 Messages Newest 20 Messages

The Preacher Feb 5th 12:16 PM
I've read through the Children of Dune script as posted on The Landsraad and although the scene where Alia fights the practice dummy is there, they've changed it. She's clothed for obvious reasons, but she is the one who ends up ending the practice session:

'This is no game. A misstep could be fatal. Several times Alia is
driven back...off balance...defensive moves barely keeping pace with
the droid's attack...until... She ounters with extraordinary
althleticism and finesse. Dodging the droid's true weapons. Slipping
through the counterfeits to... Touch the kill target. The droid's
lights flash wildly...and then dim. It retreats into peaceful repose.
And that's when.. Alia becomes aware of Paul. Standing in the doorway
Staring at her. Expression strained and tense.
Stilgar is with him. And so is... The Idaho ghola.

PAUL: "Do you know how dangerous that was?"'

Now here is the book's version:

'That attacking blade could maim and it could kill. But the finest
swordsmen in the Imperium never went against more than seven lights.
Nine! Alia experienced a sense of supreme exaltation. Attacking blade
and target became blurs among blurs. She felt that the sword in her
hand had come alive. She was an anti-target. She did not move the
blade; it moved her. Ten! Eleven! Something flashed past her
shoulder, slowed at the shield aura around the target, slid through
and tripped the deactivating stud. The lights darkened. Prisms and
target twisted their way to stillness. Alia whirled, angered by the
intrusion, but her reaction was thrown into tension by awareness of
the supreme ability which had hurled that knife. It had been a throw
timed to exquisite nicety -- just fast enough to get through the
shield zone and not too fast to be deflected. And it had touched a
one-millimeter spot within an eleven-light target. Alia found her own
emotions and tensions running down in a manner not unlike that of the
target dummy. She was not at all surprised to see who had thrown the
knife. Paul stood just inside the training room doorway, Stilgar
three steps behind him. Her brother's eyes were squinted in anger.
Alia, growing conscious of her nudity, thought to cover herself,
found the idea amusing. What the eyes had seen could not be erased.
Slowly, she replaced the crysknife in its sheath at her neck.

"I might've known," she said.

"I presume you know how dangerous that was," Paul said.'

I understand the need for artistic license, for changing the story
somewhat to fit a visual medium. I understand placing Hayt in the
scene where he wasn't in the book, to set up the growing relationship
between he and Alia. What I don't understand is the change of
fundamental nuances like having her trip the switch rather than
Paul's brilliant knife toss. I don't see how that change "adds" to
the adaptation. If anything, it detracts.

What was once a supreme piece of writing by The Master and a
brilliant illustration of Paul's mastery over himself, mind and body,
which further highlights his downfall, is lost. Even the dialogue,
while similar, is changed just enough so as to completely alter the
intent. Compare and contrast 'PAUL: "Do you know how dangerous that
was?"' versus '"I presume you know how dangerous that was," Paul
said.' The difference is subtle yet clear at the same time. The
Master's words convey at once a sense of awe and respect, of
acknowledgement of intellectual and physical powers, and finally a
sense of resignation. The script is a petulant scolding, along the
same lines of Paul's character in the FH's Dune mini.

Not only that, but imagine how this scene would have come across on
screen!! The precise timing of the throw, the shock on her face, the
effect on the audiuence as the camera and Alia discover the the
identity of the thrower and the understanding it would bring. What a
challenge for a filmmaker. The way Herbert built this scene seems
almost taylor made for visualisation... why change it?

For those of you who have a problem with us so-called "purists"
voicing our issues over the SciFi treatment of the story, this is a
clear cut example of whence our concerns were borne. And there are
countless others as well.

Although, from what I've read of the script, the new mini looks
hopeful, it is "changes" such as this that take away from the
characters and the intent of The Master. I can understand certain
changes from a media adaptation standpoint, but I do not understand
changes that don't enhance that adaptation but rather alter the
design of the characters and the author's intentions.

_________________
"I can think of nothing more poisonous than to rot in the stink of
your own reflections."
- The Lady Jessica

Julia
User ID: 1425064 Feb 6th 4:40 PM
Wow. I couldn't agree with you more!

Bravo!

Taqwa!
User ID: 9627953 Feb 7th 1:05 AM
I second that. But do you really have to call him The Master??

The Preacher Feb 7th 8:55 AM
Re: "do you really have to call him The Master??"

Sorry, can't help myself sometimes. But, if the shoe fits...

Solarisy2k
User ID: 8604013 Feb 7th 9:19 PM
FRANK HERBERT IS THE MASTER.
THA MASTER OF SCIFI
THE MASTER OF POLITICAL , SOCIOLOGY , POLITICS.
As far as Im concern he open my eyes in the uses of politics and religion as a tool for the manipulation of the mases.
Taliban's anyone?

Extra 1 Feb 7th 10:08 PM
Hehe, I like this thread. It's good to be back on the board -- it's good to have a body again. Good points 'round. If they're going to change it then they should change it alot ( like Lynch's movie ) if they want to keep it the same they should try as had as possible. Personally I wouldn't mind some nudity. But hell, I'm out of touch.

sKott Feb 12th 1:28 PM
I just have to say that I concur with you Preacher. I couldn't have said it better myself. It is always the nuance changes that bother me most. I can see leaving whole chapters out of books, for a screen adaptation, but to significantly alter a few lines of dialog for no apparent reason. I don't know.

As for nudity, wait for the director's cut on CD.

sKott Feb 27th 11:35 AM
I mean DVD

Spectre
User ID: 9719083 Feb 27th 8:29 PM
Huh? A DVD ia a CD.

Glossu Mar 5th 11:35 AM
Is there nudity in the director's cut of the first mini-series?

Spectre Mar 5th 5:37 PM
Yes, Yes! Chani does a full frontal and my jaw dropped to the floor. That woman is georgeous!

Spice Addiction
User ID: 0164614 Mar 17th 2:13 PM
There's a DUNE director's cut?
I own the two disk dvd, and I've watched it about a million times so i know there is no nudity on it....

Is there any other differences between the director's cut and the miniseries as it was on SCI-FI?

Rakkis
User ID: 1139804 Mar 17th 6:17 PM
what are you talking about? I saw Alia get naked in that scene! everything else is right on the money.

NiK
User ID: 1613614 May 20th 12:19 AM
The region 4 (Austalia) DVDs do have nudity included. Although it is very mild, I guess it was too much for the region 1 (America) censors [You remember the Janet Jackson nipple furore......] I don't think it has anything to do with any directors cut.

Freakzilla
User ID: 9719083 May 20th 5:43 AM
"The way Herbert built this scene seems
almost taylor made for visualisation... why change it?"

The whole book was like that. It reads like a screen play. Not only that it has a sexual rythym that is dirupted when you reaarange, add or delete chapters/scenes.

Adam Hellbound
User ID: 8318753 Dec 11th 5:15 AM
Dune fetishism is weird.

Seruna Kanus Dec 11th 6:32 PM
The Dune Directors Cut has 3 disks. One for each section mainly. And yes, there is modest nudity. There is also a scene of a setch(sp) orgy.

buy viagra online
User ID: 8506593 Feb 28th 12:58 AM
VinxAe Hello! I'm Dr. Desmond Phillips! I like your site - it's very good! <a href= http://buyviagraonline.blinklist.com/ > buy viagra online </a> buy viagra online [url=http://buyviagraonline.blinklist.com/] buy viagra online [/url]

prozac
User ID: 1174374 Mar 1st 3:41 AM
Your site is really good! Btw, it's Dr. Mike! <a href= http://www.blinklist.com/Buy_Best_Price_Prozac_Online/ > prozac </a> prozac [url=http://www.blinklist.com/Buy_Best_Price_Prozac_Online/] prozac [/url]

prednisone
User ID: 9363883 Mar 1st 4:24 AM
Hi! I'm Dr. Phillips and i'm glad to <a href= http://eventful.com/groups/G0-001-006881414-7/info > prednisone </a> [url=http://eventful.com/groups/G0-001-006881414-7/info] prednisone [/url] Thank you!

Next 20 Messages Newest 20 Messages

Your Name:
Authenticate:	What is Authentication?
Your Message:

The Preacher	Feb 5th 12:16 PM I've read through the Children of Dune script as posted on The Landsraad and although the scene where Alia fights the practice dummy is there, they've changed it. She's clothed for obvious reasons, but she is the one who ends up ending the practice session: 'This is no game. A misstep could be fatal. Several times Alia is driven back...off balance...defensive moves barely keeping pace with the droid's attack...until... She ounters with extraordinary althleticism and finesse. Dodging the droid's true weapons. Slipping through the counterfeits to... Touch the kill target. The droid's lights flash wildly...and then dim. It retreats into peaceful repose. And that's when.. Alia becomes aware of Paul. Standing in the doorway Staring at her. Expression strained and tense. Stilgar is with him. And so is... The Idaho ghola. PAUL: "Do you know how dangerous that was?"' Now here is the book's version: 'That attacking blade could maim and it could kill. But the finest swordsmen in the Imperium never went against more than seven lights. Nine! Alia experienced a sense of supreme exaltation. Attacking blade and target became blurs among blurs. She felt that the sword in her hand had come alive. She was an anti-target. She did not move the blade; it moved her. Ten! Eleven! Something flashed past her shoulder, slowed at the shield aura around the target, slid through and tripped the deactivating stud. The lights darkened. Prisms and target twisted their way to stillness. Alia whirled, angered by the intrusion, but her reaction was thrown into tension by awareness of the supreme ability which had hurled that knife. It had been a throw timed to exquisite nicety -- just fast enough to get through the shield zone and not too fast to be deflected. And it had touched a one-millimeter spot within an eleven-light target. Alia found her own emotions and tensions running down in a manner not unlike that of the target dummy. She was not at all surprised to see who had thrown the knife. Paul stood just inside the training room doorway, Stilgar three steps behind him. Her brother's eyes were squinted in anger. Alia, growing conscious of her nudity, thought to cover herself, found the idea amusing. What the eyes had seen could not be erased. Slowly, she replaced the crysknife in its sheath at her neck. "I might've known," she said. "I presume you know how dangerous that was," Paul said.' I understand the need for artistic license, for changing the story somewhat to fit a visual medium. I understand placing Hayt in the scene where he wasn't in the book, to set up the growing relationship between he and Alia. What I don't understand is the change of fundamental nuances like having her trip the switch rather than Paul's brilliant knife toss. I don't see how that change "adds" to the adaptation. If anything, it detracts. What was once a supreme piece of writing by The Master and a brilliant illustration of Paul's mastery over himself, mind and body, which further highlights his downfall, is lost. Even the dialogue, while similar, is changed just enough so as to completely alter the intent. Compare and contrast 'PAUL: "Do you know how dangerous that was?"' versus '"I presume you know how dangerous that was," Paul said.' The difference is subtle yet clear at the same time. The Master's words convey at once a sense of awe and respect, of acknowledgement of intellectual and physical powers, and finally a sense of resignation. The script is a petulant scolding, along the same lines of Paul's character in the FH's Dune mini. Not only that, but imagine how this scene would have come across on screen!! The precise timing of the throw, the shock on her face, the effect on the audiuence as the camera and Alia discover the the identity of the thrower and the understanding it would bring. What a challenge for a filmmaker. The way Herbert built this scene seems almost taylor made for visualisation... why change it? For those of you who have a problem with us so-called "purists" voicing our issues over the SciFi treatment of the story, this is a clear cut example of whence our concerns were borne. And there are countless others as well. Although, from what I've read of the script, the new mini looks hopeful, it is "changes" such as this that take away from the characters and the intent of The Master. I can understand certain changes from a media adaptation standpoint, but I do not understand changes that don't enhance that adaptation but rather alter the design of the characters and the author's intentions. _________________ "I can think of nothing more poisonous than to rot in the stink of your own reflections." - The Lady Jessica
Julia User ID: 1425064	Feb 6th 4:40 PM Wow. I couldn't agree with you more! Bravo!
Taqwa! User ID: 9627953	Feb 7th 1:05 AM I second that. But do you really have to call him The Master??
The Preacher	Feb 7th 8:55 AM Re: "do you really have to call him The Master??" Sorry, can't help myself sometimes. But, if the shoe fits...
Solarisy2k User ID: 8604013	Feb 7th 9:19 PM FRANK HERBERT IS THE MASTER. THA MASTER OF SCIFI THE MASTER OF POLITICAL , SOCIOLOGY , POLITICS. As far as Im concern he open my eyes in the uses of politics and religion as a tool for the manipulation of the mases. Taliban's anyone?
Extra 1	Feb 7th 10:08 PM Hehe, I like this thread. It's good to be back on the board -- it's good to have a body again. Good points 'round. If they're going to change it then they should change it alot ( like Lynch's movie ) if they want to keep it the same they should try as had as possible. Personally I wouldn't mind some nudity. But hell, I'm out of touch.
sKott	Feb 12th 1:28 PM I just have to say that I concur with you Preacher. I couldn't have said it better myself. It is always the nuance changes that bother me most. I can see leaving whole chapters out of books, for a screen adaptation, but to significantly alter a few lines of dialog for no apparent reason. I don't know. As for nudity, wait for the director's cut on CD.
sKott	Feb 27th 11:35 AM I mean DVD
Spectre User ID: 9719083	Feb 27th 8:29 PM Huh? A DVD ia a CD.
Glossu	Mar 5th 11:35 AM Is there nudity in the director's cut of the first mini-series?
Spectre	Mar 5th 5:37 PM Yes, Yes! Chani does a full frontal and my jaw dropped to the floor. That woman is georgeous!
Spice Addiction User ID: 0164614	Mar 17th 2:13 PM There's a DUNE director's cut? I own the two disk dvd, and I've watched it about a million times so i know there is no nudity on it.... Is there any other differences between the director's cut and the miniseries as it was on SCI-FI?
Rakkis User ID: 1139804	Mar 17th 6:17 PM what are you talking about? I saw Alia get naked in that scene! everything else is right on the money.
NiK User ID: 1613614	May 20th 12:19 AM The region 4 (Austalia) DVDs do have nudity included. Although it is very mild, I guess it was too much for the region 1 (America) censors [You remember the Janet Jackson nipple furore......] I don't think it has anything to do with any directors cut.
Freakzilla User ID: 9719083	May 20th 5:43 AM "The way Herbert built this scene seems almost taylor made for visualisation... why change it?" The whole book was like that. It reads like a screen play. Not only that it has a sexual rythym that is dirupted when you reaarange, add or delete chapters/scenes.
Adam Hellbound User ID: 8318753	Dec 11th 5:15 AM Dune fetishism is weird.
Seruna Kanus	Dec 11th 6:32 PM The Dune Directors Cut has 3 disks. One for each section mainly. And yes, there is modest nudity. There is also a scene of a setch(sp) orgy.
buy viagra online User ID: 8506593	Feb 28th 12:58 AM VinxAe Hello! I'm Dr. Desmond Phillips! I like your site - it's very good! <a href= http://buyviagraonline.blinklist.com/ > buy viagra online </a> buy viagra online [url=http://buyviagraonline.blinklist.com/] buy viagra online [/url]
prozac User ID: 1174374	Mar 1st 3:41 AM Your site is really good! Btw, it's Dr. Mike! <a href= http://www.blinklist.com/Buy_Best_Price_Prozac_Online/ > prozac </a> prozac [url=http://www.blinklist.com/Buy_Best_Price_Prozac_Online/] prozac [/url]
prednisone User ID: 9363883	Mar 1st 4:24 AM Hi! I'm Dr. Phillips and i'm glad to <a href= http://eventful.com/groups/G0-001-006881414-7/info > prednisone </a> [url=http://eventful.com/groups/G0-001-006881414-7/info] prednisone [/url] Thank you!