C Melody Saxophone Forum

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C Melody Saxophone Forum / Repairs and Refurbishing / Question about Snaps

Back 20 Messages

WW2
User ID: 8973393 Oct 16th 5:55 PM
Well, I finally started taking apart my Buescher TT C-Mel for the first timer’s overhaul I have been planning. I discovered the snap nipples are still on the keys that were missing their pads. Also, the pads that are still on the saxophone seem to be glued in with copious amounts of shellac. So much shellac that on one pad that it ran across the surface of the pad, the reflector, out the side of the tone hole and pooled between two tonehole chimneys. It cleaned off nicely.

So, with Buescher Snap Pads, were they glued in or just snapped in? What is the usual practice of you repair technicians out there?

Just for fun a young friend of my decided to try to polish the nearly black silver plating. He got the old silver to shine quite nicely. It only cost him a little blood, three Band-Aids, and three alcohol wipes. This started a discussion on why needle springs are sharp, and could they have their tips blunted without affecting their performance. He also asked if he could remove the springs to make the polishing less painful. Alas, I have no spring pliers, so our mild attempts to remove a spring were futile.

This is going to be a long slow process…

bruce bailey
User ID: 9690803 Nov 1st 2:46 AM
I have a set of snaps in a horn with a good neck and case. It is a pretty original TT that I never got around to fixing. Post back if you are interested.

C
User ID: 1738604 Nov 1st 5:50 AM
Wade...What a result.Beats advertising in the local parochial paper does it not? How did life exist before the Interweb?

alan (uk)
User ID: 0651814 Nov 1st 7:25 PM
Wade - I forgot that as you're on 110/120v, your appliance cables are almost twice the thickness as our 240v ones (W=VxA for those of a technical mind), so the equivalent to the insulation I use here would have been big-bore in the US...

I would have guessed you had a selection of different gauge wire around, though. If you build the case from cedar wood, it will help remove the smell from the sax !

WW2
User ID: 8973393 Nov 2nd 1:29 PM
Bruce, email me at wwalkerjr@verizon.net

WW2
User ID: 8973393 Nov 5th 7:39 PM
Thought I would quickly post an update on the distractions to the repad/rebuild:

The fires are nearly out. Only two of the original twenty fires are still burning without full containment. Fortunately the strong Santa Ana winds forecast for the past weekend were weaker than expected. Temperatures are lower and humidity is way up. We are having dense fog in the mornings, so this is helping to put the fires down. Hopefully they will all be contained by the end of the week, and out in a couple of weeks. The air is considerably better with only an occasional smell of smoke. Unfortunately, these fires have contributed over 8.4 million tons of greenhouse gases to the atmosphere. The equivalent of 2 million cars running for a year!

Also, my brother is doing fine!

Now if only work, school, and family life did not interfere with the hobby...

alan (uk)
User ID: 0651814 Nov 6th 11:17 AM
"8.4 million tons of greenhouse gases - equivalent of 2 million cars running for a year" - that is why it's so difficult to convince any individual that their contribution to saving the planet makes a difference.

Big loss of 'green lung' as well, although nature has a great way of recovering - if left to it's own devices...

soybean
User ID: 9844073 Nov 20th 1:44 PM
(2007)
You may be able to salvage that case by eliminating the smell. There are quite a few posts here and on SOTW about eliminating odors. Activated charcoal and also coffee work well. Put some in open containers (careful not to spill) inside your case for a week or so. That should get rid of the smell.

jazzbug1 2007
User ID: 0735934 Nov 21st 8:46 AM
I have eliminated the smell in some cases by using Fabreeze and leaving the case outside for a month, or even better, letting a fan blow on it. I have built two soprano cases. They are much easier than a case for a curved horn. Tampa Dave has case hardware at nice prices. Good luck.

Mal-2k8
User ID: 9335603 Feb 26th 12:02 AM
Might I offer a couple of ideas regarding a custom case?

First, if you are building from scratch or even just replacing a panel, using a little bit of cedar would keep away any insects that like to munch on felt. You don't need much, just a thin lining in the "accessory area" might do.

Second, it's not cheap, but foamcore art board works nicely for custom cases. Since it comes in 1/8" or 3/16" thick pieces, and it's just small-grain styrofoam with paper on both sides, it's easy to cut with a X-acto knife or other small, sharp blade. Build up in layers and glue them together -- you can even use solvent-rich glues like rubber cement on the paper faces (though you risk melting the exposed edges). When in doubt, make the compartments too tight, then file them out as necessary. Cloth glues to the stuff nicely as well. It works great for partial repairs too -- wherever you have damage to existing foam, you can cut out a nice, regular-shaped chunk and build up a foamcore replacement to glue in.

As for stinky cases, my bari case smells like a truckload of chocolate bars melted in there and then soured. I've never managed to get the smell out, but luckily it's more annoying than disgusting and doesn't seem to transfer onto the instrument itself.

My tenor gig bag apparently has fine black sand in it somewhere, which is leaking into the accessory pouch, and even manages to get inside the Altoids tin I use to stash reeds. This is much more annoying than the stinky bari case.

bruce bailey 2008
User ID: 9690803 Feb 26th 12:10 AM
I put in dryer sheets and change them weekly for about a month.

Mal-2k8
User ID: 9335603 Feb 26th 12:19 AM
There's an idea! Most recently I tried tossing in a metric buttload (10% bigger than an American buttload) of baking powder and vacuumed it out the next day. Then I flipped the case over and repeated the process. It's made an improvement, but not that much. I don't think it's getting to the source of the smell, wherever that may be. My nose seems to think it's uniformly distributed throughout the case. Since I don't open the case all that much (the bari lives on a stand usually), it can get pretty intense.

Not only does it sound like you've had success with your method, but it's a lot easier than mine. I'll probably need two or three dryer sheets at a time just because of the volume of a bari case, but the difference in effort would be ridiculously close to zero.

jazzbug1 2008
User ID: 0735934 Feb 26th 6:59 AM
I use Fabreeze and dryer sheets. Sometimes the smell comes back, so just keep a dryer sheet in the case. Be careful about sand, as it can do some damage to moving parts.

Mal-2k8
User ID: 9335603 Feb 26th 9:19 PM
I wish I knew WHY there was sand in my gig bag. It seems to have been placed there as ballast so it would stand up on its own, but whatever was intended to contain it has apparently failed to do so. Luckily it's leaking into the side pouch rather than the main compartment.

bruce bailey 2008
User ID: 9690803 Feb 26th 11:54 PM
There is sand in your case because life's a beach. I don't like the smell of febreeze, too much like a cheap hotel room. I like the dryer sheets since they smell like a brothel.

WW2 in 2008
User ID: 0498634 Feb 27th 6:14 PM
Good idea Mal-2K8. If I ever get around to it, I might give it a try. The foam board sure seems easier than molding foam from a liquid state around my saxes!

Back 20 Messages

WW2 User ID: 8973393	Oct 16th 5:55 PM Well, I finally started taking apart my Buescher TT C-Mel for the first timer’s overhaul I have been planning. I discovered the snap nipples are still on the keys that were missing their pads. Also, the pads that are still on the saxophone seem to be glued in with copious amounts of shellac. So much shellac that on one pad that it ran across the surface of the pad, the reflector, out the side of the tone hole and pooled between two tonehole chimneys. It cleaned off nicely. So, with Buescher Snap Pads, were they glued in or just snapped in? What is the usual practice of you repair technicians out there? Just for fun a young friend of my decided to try to polish the nearly black silver plating. He got the old silver to shine quite nicely. It only cost him a little blood, three Band-Aids, and three alcohol wipes. This started a discussion on why needle springs are sharp, and could they have their tips blunted without affecting their performance. He also asked if he could remove the springs to make the polishing less painful. Alas, I have no spring pliers, so our mild attempts to remove a spring were futile. This is going to be a long slow process…
bruce bailey User ID: 9690803	Nov 1st 2:46 AM I have a set of snaps in a horn with a good neck and case. It is a pretty original TT that I never got around to fixing. Post back if you are interested.
C User ID: 1738604	Nov 1st 5:50 AM Wade...What a result.Beats advertising in the local parochial paper does it not? How did life exist before the Interweb?
alan (uk) User ID: 0651814	Nov 1st 7:25 PM Wade - I forgot that as you're on 110/120v, your appliance cables are almost twice the thickness as our 240v ones (W=VxA for those of a technical mind), so the equivalent to the insulation I use here would have been big-bore in the US... I would have guessed you had a selection of different gauge wire around, though. If you build the case from cedar wood, it will help remove the smell from the sax !
WW2 User ID: 8973393	Nov 2nd 1:29 PM Bruce, email me at wwalkerjr@verizon.net
WW2 User ID: 8973393	Nov 5th 7:39 PM Thought I would quickly post an update on the distractions to the repad/rebuild: The fires are nearly out. Only two of the original twenty fires are still burning without full containment. Fortunately the strong Santa Ana winds forecast for the past weekend were weaker than expected. Temperatures are lower and humidity is way up. We are having dense fog in the mornings, so this is helping to put the fires down. Hopefully they will all be contained by the end of the week, and out in a couple of weeks. The air is considerably better with only an occasional smell of smoke. Unfortunately, these fires have contributed over 8.4 million tons of greenhouse gases to the atmosphere. The equivalent of 2 million cars running for a year! Also, my brother is doing fine! Now if only work, school, and family life did not interfere with the hobby...
alan (uk) User ID: 0651814	Nov 6th 11:17 AM "8.4 million tons of greenhouse gases - equivalent of 2 million cars running for a year" - that is why it's so difficult to convince any individual that their contribution to saving the planet makes a difference. Big loss of 'green lung' as well, although nature has a great way of recovering - if left to it's own devices...
soybean User ID: 9844073	Nov 20th 1:44 PM (2007) You may be able to salvage that case by eliminating the smell. There are quite a few posts here and on SOTW about eliminating odors. Activated charcoal and also coffee work well. Put some in open containers (careful not to spill) inside your case for a week or so. That should get rid of the smell.
jazzbug1 2007 User ID: 0735934	Nov 21st 8:46 AM I have eliminated the smell in some cases by using Fabreeze and leaving the case outside for a month, or even better, letting a fan blow on it. I have built two soprano cases. They are much easier than a case for a curved horn. Tampa Dave has case hardware at nice prices. Good luck.
Mal-2k8 User ID: 9335603	Feb 26th 12:02 AM Might I offer a couple of ideas regarding a custom case? First, if you are building from scratch or even just replacing a panel, using a little bit of cedar would keep away any insects that like to munch on felt. You don't need much, just a thin lining in the "accessory area" might do. Second, it's not cheap, but foamcore art board works nicely for custom cases. Since it comes in 1/8" or 3/16" thick pieces, and it's just small-grain styrofoam with paper on both sides, it's easy to cut with a X-acto knife or other small, sharp blade. Build up in layers and glue them together -- you can even use solvent-rich glues like rubber cement on the paper faces (though you risk melting the exposed edges). When in doubt, make the compartments too tight, then file them out as necessary. Cloth glues to the stuff nicely as well. It works great for partial repairs too -- wherever you have damage to existing foam, you can cut out a nice, regular-shaped chunk and build up a foamcore replacement to glue in. As for stinky cases, my bari case smells like a truckload of chocolate bars melted in there and then soured. I've never managed to get the smell out, but luckily it's more annoying than disgusting and doesn't seem to transfer onto the instrument itself. My tenor gig bag apparently has fine black sand in it somewhere, which is leaking into the accessory pouch, and even manages to get inside the Altoids tin I use to stash reeds. This is much more annoying than the stinky bari case.
bruce bailey 2008 User ID: 9690803	Feb 26th 12:10 AM I put in dryer sheets and change them weekly for about a month.
Mal-2k8 User ID: 9335603	Feb 26th 12:19 AM There's an idea! Most recently I tried tossing in a metric buttload (10% bigger than an American buttload) of baking powder and vacuumed it out the next day. Then I flipped the case over and repeated the process. It's made an improvement, but not that much. I don't think it's getting to the source of the smell, wherever that may be. My nose seems to think it's uniformly distributed throughout the case. Since I don't open the case all that much (the bari lives on a stand usually), it can get pretty intense. Not only does it sound like you've had success with your method, but it's a lot easier than mine. I'll probably need two or three dryer sheets at a time just because of the volume of a bari case, but the difference in effort would be ridiculously close to zero.
jazzbug1 2008 User ID: 0735934	Feb 26th 6:59 AM I use Fabreeze and dryer sheets. Sometimes the smell comes back, so just keep a dryer sheet in the case. Be careful about sand, as it can do some damage to moving parts.
Mal-2k8 User ID: 9335603	Feb 26th 9:19 PM I wish I knew WHY there was sand in my gig bag. It seems to have been placed there as ballast so it would stand up on its own, but whatever was intended to contain it has apparently failed to do so. Luckily it's leaking into the side pouch rather than the main compartment.
bruce bailey 2008 User ID: 9690803	Feb 26th 11:54 PM There is sand in your case because life's a beach. I don't like the smell of febreeze, too much like a cheap hotel room. I like the dryer sheets since they smell like a brothel.
WW2 in 2008 User ID: 0498634	Feb 27th 6:14 PM Good idea Mal-2K8. If I ever get around to it, I might give it a try. The foam board sure seems easier than molding foam from a liquid state around my saxes!