C Melody Saxophone Forum

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C Melody Saxophone Forum / C-Tenor (C-Melody) Saxophones / Newbie

Kerry Tiller
User ID: 1258494 Jun 2nd 12:38 AM
I just stumbled on this forum when I googled C-Melody Saxophones. I suspect you people can give me guidence. I would like to have mine restored, though the restoration may cost more than the horn is worth. It's a sentamental thing. I bought my C-Melody from a pawn shop in Tucson, Arizona in 1970 for $35. It is a Conn made in 1923. Not an expensive instrument when it was new. The German nickel/silver finish was already mostly oxidized when I bought it, but it more than less played OK (no dents). After a few replacement pads and springs from Tenor and Alto repair kits, the old girl produced a Freddy Martin melowness That served me well in amateur Broadway Pit bands and the like throughout the 1970s (I often played the "Reed 5" book that had in it all the instruments we didn't have in the amateur reed section). I haven't played it in about 25 years. The low B Flat key was never in tune (and I suspect this was the case when it was new). Anyway, I would like to get it restored, both mechanically and cosmetically.
Thoughts, comments and suggestions?
Respectfully,
Kerry Tiller
Tucson Arizona

alan (uk)
User ID: 1341734 Jun 2nd 3:42 AM
Kerry - you seem to have almost convinced yourself..... I suppose the only question is, will you be playing it again. or is it just because the C-Mel has "grown on you" and deserves a little tlc ?

Of all the popular C-Mels, Conn's seem to often fetch the better prices - although you almost certainly would never recoup all the cost. But then, there are probably loads of other things you could easily spend that money on, and would any of them match having your old friend brought back to life ?

Kind Regards, Alan.

(cmelodysax.co.uk - if Google didn't find that as well...)

Kerry Tiller
User ID: 1258494 Jun 2nd 6:47 PM
Alan,
Thanks for your response. I certainly don't intend to sell my C-Mel, and, yes, I would like to play it again (actually I have played it recently. It's in better shape than my chops). I guess my real quandry is can I afford a restoration. Pads, springs, cork, rollers etc. I assume will be no problem. The stumbling block is having it re-plated. I would like to see it in its original high polish nickel finish. I know in the collectable firearm world, re-finishing is a no-no (destroys or greatly reduces value) is it the same with vintage musical instruments? Also, is there anyone who specializes in re-nickeling old horns?
Thanks also for the URL, I hadn't seen it.
Regards, Kerry

alan (uk)
User ID: 1341734 Jun 2nd 8:27 PM
Kerry, I'm a little confused where you refer to "The German nickel/silver finish"...

Are you sure it's nickel plated, because it's not very usual for that finish to deteriorate. Usually it's the matt/bright silver plate that oxidises badly or wears thro' to the brass.

I've heard of saxes being (re-)silverplated, but re-nickeled ? Might just be an idea to take it back to bare brass.

Kerry Tiller
User ID: 1258494 Jun 2nd 9:33 PM
Well, Alan, I'm going by the period ad as shown on the UK website you refered me to. The verious finishes put on Conn C-melody's are shown and described. Mine fits the high polish nickel pic and description. It is not a satin finish, and the inside of the bell is the same high polish silver color as the rest of the sax. No "yellow metal" color anywhere. At least 85% of the plating is intact, but not all of it will hold a mirror finish any longer. There is verdigris present around the few areas of exposed brass. I'm on a steep learning curve here. Is it nickel or is it silver? My referance to "German nickel-silver" is an old name for a nickel/copper (and sometimes zinc) alloy that has no silver in it, but can produce a silver-like finish when polished.
After perusing a few vintage sax restoration sites, it looks like I am facing 11 to 14 hundred dollars for a rebuild/re-plate (silver) job. does that sound about right?
regards, Kerry

Captain Muggles
User ID: 8945823 Jun 2nd 9:59 PM
Kerry Tiller...Usually the nickle plated finishes on the Conns hold up really well. Unless its been under water, I can not imagine it deteriorating that much!

Kerry Tiller
User ID: 1258494 Jun 2nd 11:02 PM
To quote Alice: "curiouser and curiouser". This instrument has been in the desert (Southern Arizona) for at least as long as I have owned it (37 years) and in that time there has been no noticable change in its deterioration. More verdigris in the brass exposed pockets, but the plating is in the same condition it was in when I bought it in 1970. The dry climate plays havoc with my guitars and mandolins, but metal stuff is usually OK if I keep it protected from my swamp cooler. Any finish damage was done to my C-Melody before I owned it. I know from experiance that when nickel plating on steel (guns) goes; it flacks off. It is either there or it isn't. I don't know how it deteriorates on a brass base. Is ther anyway I can tell for sure if my C-Melody has a silver or nickel finish?
Thanks for your responses
Regards, Kerry

ukebert
User ID: 9906923 Jun 3rd 6:29 AM
German Silver was used for metal clarinets, saxes were made of brass and plated with straight nickel I believe. However, you may well be right.

Have a go with a wet cloth trying to get some of it off, it is likely that there will be some way of restoring it without resorting to replating.

Kerry Tiller User ID: 1258494	Jun 2nd 12:38 AM I just stumbled on this forum when I googled C-Melody Saxophones. I suspect you people can give me guidence. I would like to have mine restored, though the restoration may cost more than the horn is worth. It's a sentamental thing. I bought my C-Melody from a pawn shop in Tucson, Arizona in 1970 for $35. It is a Conn made in 1923. Not an expensive instrument when it was new. The German nickel/silver finish was already mostly oxidized when I bought it, but it more than less played OK (no dents). After a few replacement pads and springs from Tenor and Alto repair kits, the old girl produced a Freddy Martin melowness That served me well in amateur Broadway Pit bands and the like throughout the 1970s (I often played the "Reed 5" book that had in it all the instruments we didn't have in the amateur reed section). I haven't played it in about 25 years. The low B Flat key was never in tune (and I suspect this was the case when it was new). Anyway, I would like to get it restored, both mechanically and cosmetically. Thoughts, comments and suggestions? Respectfully, Kerry Tiller Tucson Arizona
alan (uk) User ID: 1341734	Jun 2nd 3:42 AM Kerry - you seem to have almost convinced yourself..... I suppose the only question is, will you be playing it again. or is it just because the C-Mel has "grown on you" and deserves a little tlc ? Of all the popular C-Mels, Conn's seem to often fetch the better prices - although you almost certainly would never recoup all the cost. But then, there are probably loads of other things you could easily spend that money on, and would any of them match having your old friend brought back to life ? Kind Regards, Alan. (cmelodysax.co.uk - if Google didn't find that as well...)
Kerry Tiller User ID: 1258494	Jun 2nd 6:47 PM Alan, Thanks for your response. I certainly don't intend to sell my C-Mel, and, yes, I would like to play it again (actually I have played it recently. It's in better shape than my chops). I guess my real quandry is can I afford a restoration. Pads, springs, cork, rollers etc. I assume will be no problem. The stumbling block is having it re-plated. I would like to see it in its original high polish nickel finish. I know in the collectable firearm world, re-finishing is a no-no (destroys or greatly reduces value) is it the same with vintage musical instruments? Also, is there anyone who specializes in re-nickeling old horns? Thanks also for the URL, I hadn't seen it. Regards, Kerry
alan (uk) User ID: 1341734	Jun 2nd 8:27 PM Kerry, I'm a little confused where you refer to "The German nickel/silver finish"... Are you sure it's nickel plated, because it's not very usual for that finish to deteriorate. Usually it's the matt/bright silver plate that oxidises badly or wears thro' to the brass. I've heard of saxes being (re-)silverplated, but re-nickeled ? Might just be an idea to take it back to bare brass.
Kerry Tiller User ID: 1258494	Jun 2nd 9:33 PM Well, Alan, I'm going by the period ad as shown on the UK website you refered me to. The verious finishes put on Conn C-melody's are shown and described. Mine fits the high polish nickel pic and description. It is not a satin finish, and the inside of the bell is the same high polish silver color as the rest of the sax. No "yellow metal" color anywhere. At least 85% of the plating is intact, but not all of it will hold a mirror finish any longer. There is verdigris present around the few areas of exposed brass. I'm on a steep learning curve here. Is it nickel or is it silver? My referance to "German nickel-silver" is an old name for a nickel/copper (and sometimes zinc) alloy that has no silver in it, but can produce a silver-like finish when polished. After perusing a few vintage sax restoration sites, it looks like I am facing 11 to 14 hundred dollars for a rebuild/re-plate (silver) job. does that sound about right? regards, Kerry
Captain Muggles User ID: 8945823	Jun 2nd 9:59 PM Kerry Tiller...Usually the nickle plated finishes on the Conns hold up really well. Unless its been under water, I can not imagine it deteriorating that much!
Kerry Tiller User ID: 1258494	Jun 2nd 11:02 PM To quote Alice: "curiouser and curiouser". This instrument has been in the desert (Southern Arizona) for at least as long as I have owned it (37 years) and in that time there has been no noticable change in its deterioration. More verdigris in the brass exposed pockets, but the plating is in the same condition it was in when I bought it in 1970. The dry climate plays havoc with my guitars and mandolins, but metal stuff is usually OK if I keep it protected from my swamp cooler. Any finish damage was done to my C-Melody before I owned it. I know from experiance that when nickel plating on steel (guns) goes; it flacks off. It is either there or it isn't. I don't know how it deteriorates on a brass base. Is ther anyway I can tell for sure if my C-Melody has a silver or nickel finish? Thanks for your responses Regards, Kerry
ukebert User ID: 9906923	Jun 3rd 6:29 AM German Silver was used for metal clarinets, saxes were made of brass and plated with straight nickel I believe. However, you may well be right. Have a go with a wet cloth trying to get some of it off, it is likely that there will be some way of restoring it without resorting to replating.